In the latest episode of Victors in Grad School, we had the privilege of delving into the remarkable journey of Dr. Donald Tomalia, a pioneering figure in the field of chemistry and an inspiring role model for many. Dr. Tomalia, now in his 80s and still actively contributing to the field, shared his insights on the development of new molecular architectures, his career journey, and the unwavering curiosity that has driven his success.
Pioneering Dendrimer Research
Dr. Donald Tomalia is widely acknowledged for his groundbreaking work on dendrimers – dendritic polymers with branching patterns inspired by natural structures like trees and neurons. Discovered at Dow Chemical Company in 1979, dendrimers have since become pivotal in various applications, such as targeted cancer therapies and vaccine delivery systems. In particular, their capability to deliver messenger RNA for vaccines represents a significant leap forward in medical science.
Working alongside groups in the US and Europe, Dr. Tomalia continues to push the boundaries of chemistry. His work emphasizes the creation of new molecular structures, leading to discoveries with far-reaching implications for medicine, agriculture, and environmental science.
The Role of Mentorship and Education
Dr. Tomalia’s educational journey began at Flint Junior College, before moving on to the University of Michigan Flint where he found invaluable mentorship under the guidance of Professor Harry Blecker. The fundamental knowledge and support he received were instrumental in shaping his academic and professional pursuits. Despite financial constraints, scholarships and fellowships enabled him to pursue higher education and eventually attain a PhD from Michigan State University while working at Dow.
He attributes his success not to luck, but to hard work and persistence. For Dr. Tomalia, mentors played a critical role in his journey. Figures like Dr. Harry Blecker and Professor Adi Makela provided the encouragement and guidance necessary to navigate the uncertainties of a scientific career. He advises graduate students to find mentors who can inspire confidence and fuel their curiosity, emphasizing that hard work and dedication are essential for achieving success.
Balancing Professional and Personal Life
Balancing a demanding career with personal responsibilities has been a recurring theme in Dr. Tomalia’s story. He shares candidly about the challenges of maintaining this balance, yet his passion for chemistry and the continual evolution of his work have kept him engaged and excited throughout the years.
Legacy and Future Directions
Dr. Donald Tomalia’s contributions to the field of chemistry, particularly in dendrimer research, have laid a foundation for future innovations. As the CEO and owner of Nano Synthons LLC, and founder of companies like Dendritech and Dendritic Nanotechnologies, his work continues to inspire and drive progress in therapeutic delivery systems.
This conversation underscores the dynamic interplay between curiosity, mentorship, and persistence. Dr. Tomalia’s journey serves as a testament to the potential of scientific inquiry and the transformative power of education. As Dr. Christopher Lewis eloquently closed the episode, it’s clear that Dr. Tomalia’s work will continue to influence and inspire future generations of chemists and researchers. For those seeking to follow in his footsteps, the University of Michigan Flint offers a robust platform to embark on their academic journey, with graduate programs tailored to provide comprehensive education and mentorship.
TRANSCRIPT
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:01]:
Welcome to the Victor’s in Grad School, where we have conversations with students, alumni, and experts about what it takes to find success in graduate school.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:00:11]:
Welcome back to Victor’s in Grad School. I’m your host, doctor Christopher Lewis, director of graduate programs at the University of Michigan Flint. Really excited to have you back again this week. You know, every week, I love going on a journey with you. And it is a journey because you may be at the very forefront of starting to think about graduate school. But you came to listen today because you’re thinking grad school in some aspect, whether you’re at the very beginning and you’re just starting to look at different schools or different programs to see what’s out there and what might be a possibility, or maybe you’ve already applied or gotten accepted. You know, you’re somewhere in this continuum. You could even be in graduate school looking for that light at the end of the tunnel where you know that you’ve got another year ahead of you, and you’re just working through this process for yourself.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:01:01]:
Wherever you are, this podcast was set up to help you to find success in that journey that you’re on. And that’s why every week I love being able to talk to you, talk to you about this journey, but also to give you some tools for your toolbox to help you along the way. And we do that by bringing you different guests, different people that are able to tell you their story and able to share that journey that they went on so that you can learn from the things that went well, maybe things that didn’t go well, and be able to take those things, internalize them, and find a path for yourself. Today, we’ve got another great guest with us today. Dr. Donald Tomalia is with us today, and Dr.Tomalia started his undergraduate work at the University of Michigan Flint, but then went on and got a PH d at Michigan State University. Both of those degrees were in chemistry. So we’re gonna be talking about that journey that he was on. I’m really excited to talk to him and the journey that led him to be the CEO and owner of Nano Synthons LLC, and I’m really excited to have him here.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:08]:
Doctor Tomalia, thanks so much for being here.
Dr. Donald Tomalia [00:02:10]:
It’s my pleasure.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:02:11]:
So first and foremost, I wanna turn the clock back in time. You did your undergraduate work at the University of Michigan Flint. And while you were at the University of Michigan Flint, you got a degree in organic chemistry. And somewhere along that line, you made a decision. You made a decision that you wanted to go further. You wanted to continue your education. Bring me back to that point in time and where you were at in your mind and why you decided graduate school was the right path for you.
Dr. Donald Tomalia [00:02:42]:
I actually was going to the I went to the Flint Junior College for my first two years, and I had a real deep passion for chemistry and science, but didn’t really quite know how I was gonna make a living at it. However, I found a couple of real mentors in the Flint, Junior College faculty as well as on the faculty of the, University of Michigan Flint College. And the key person at the U of M Flint was doctor Harry Blacker, who really started your whole chemistry department back in gosh, I even lost track of what decade it was, but it was back in the seventies, I think, or sixties or fifties. He was there only a few years before I arrived on campus from, Flint County College. I think they call it not community college. In any case, I I came from a middle class family. My father is an accountant, a CPA from Flushing. I was born and raised in the Flushing area.
Dr. Donald Tomalia [00:03:38]:
I couldn’t afford to go to a pedigree, school like Harvard or East or as West Coast University. So I had to find my education as close as possible, and I had to find an education route that would I could actually afford. I was lucky enough to get a scholarship not only from the Lions Club in the Flushing Flint area, but I got an undergraduate fellowship from the, University of Michigan Board of Regents that covered my 2 years in Flint. And it, I can tell you, is probably some of the most precious and important days of my life because it really launched me into a career that I have I’m 86, and I have never had a boring moment in my life, ever since I left my undergraduate days because I picked the right profession to match my personality, my interest, and it was a a unique way that I arrived there. And that it was because my I’ve been told my parents, especially my mother, knew that I was a person that once I understood something or I learned how to do something or I solve the problem, I get bored quite quickly. And her biggest challenge was to find things to keep me interested because I would be solving these things. And I said, oh, well, that’s done. We don’t have any more to do there.
Dr. Donald Tomalia [00:04:59]:
So she said, if you’re gonna ever feel you’re going to be able to live a happy and fulfilling life, you’re gonna have to really be sure you pick a profession or an area that you will love and enjoy. Like, it’s a hobby, and it’s not really like it’s work the way we think of going to work and earning a living. And I was just fortunate enough to find that chemistry to me seemed to be that route. It seemed to be the core. It was the essence of everything that we have in in our life, all the way from the environment, to food, to medication, to the way we even live, fact that we depend on all of these intricate chemistry processes and and, just to have good health and to be alive. And in any case, this started me on a path that I thought was going to be like a hobby. I never thought about I was gonna have to make a living someday. And so I finished my 2 years at U of M Lamp.
Dr. Donald Tomalia [00:06:03]:
I was mentored and coached by faculty members in Ann Arbor, U of Ann Arbor, and they encouraged me to go to a small university out east called Bucknell University. And several of the faculty members had either been students there or taught there, and they said it had the perfect environment for what I was looking for. And that was I I love solving problems. I love trying to understand what makes things work, what is life about, what are patterns, how does all of this come together to give us what we take for granted each and every day, and it it involves some type of chemistry or some form of chemistry. And when I made that trip out to Bucknell for a master’s degree, everybody says you’ve gotta go on for your PhD. Where are you gonna go? Well, my father informed me that I can’t be a professional student all my life. This is the time when I really have to be thinking about what I’m gonna do to make a living, and I had actually become married. I became married during that time, and I was actually 22, 21, and have our first child.
Dr. Donald Tomalia [00:07:12]:
And so I was really encouraged to try to get into a paying professional position. And of all things, the Doc Chemical company came along and they made me an offer I couldn’t refuse. It was during those golden years when there were so many jobs. I had, like, 12 or 13 job opportunities, and Dow was just one of them. But it turns out to be one of the best. So after finishing at Button Hill, I came back here to Midland to start working for Dom with a master’s degree. And I within 2 to 3 years, I realized that all of a sudden, I’ve got 10 or 12 PhDs reporting to me for some reason because I’ve always have a lot of ideas. I always like to do things and get things done and improve things.
Dr. Donald Tomalia [00:07:55]:
And Finding Dile Management said, Tamalia, you probably are going to have to go back and get what they call your union card. And they said it’s called a PhD because if you have this PhDs working for you, it’s gonna it’s gonna get more difficult, with time not having some kind of proof that you have the qualifications to lead. And that is what prompted Don Langhorne to make a proposition to me, and that was if you are willing to go back and do your PhD, which by the at that time, they had a nice arrangement with Michigan State for graduate study. If you are willing to do that, we allow you to do all your research in our laboratories, and you won’t have to leave your job. You could continue to make your salary, etcetera. I couldn’t believe it. And in fact, they came through with flying colors because they literally paid for about 3 years of graduate work at Michigan State. I think only the only thing I had to pay for was the binding of my thesis, which was about $35.
Dr. Donald Tomalia [00:08:55]:
And I had a complete PhD within 3 years after I started at Don Chemical Company. And it it’s a strange way I didn’t oh, the main reason is they had a residency requirement that I said I couldn’t afford to take the 1 year off to go in the residency because I really had to earn the money to support my family. And they waived the residency requirement, and they allowed me to use that facilities to do my PhD research and my product altogether into a thesis. And I graduated in 1968 from Michigan State. And by the time, I was leading a pretty big group. I had 20 some people in my group by that time. And I was having so much fun. I almost couldn’t find my way to have to leave the lab and come home every evening.
Dr. Donald Tomalia [00:09:38]:
I just love being in the lab as much as I could, but it did lead to some other things that I’d like to share with you as time went on. And among them were because of this opportunity, not only created them by U of M Flint because they were close. They had good mentors there, especially doctor Harry Blecker, and there were people at the Mott College or the Flint Junior College at that time. One of them was was Adi Makela, professor Makela. He was a Finnish scientist who came and taught me a lot of analytical chemistry. But it was that unique environment in the Flint area. When I went back to visit with you folks a few months ago, I couldn’t believe how much you have progressed in advance because I hadn’t been there in quite a few years in the Flint area. But we were really housed in less than maybe 4 or 5 small to modest buildings.
Dr. Donald Tomalia [00:10:31]:
That was the University of Michigan Flint College. But what get out of that experience that was so unique, in my opinion, was this close relationship with faculty members who were outstanding that had all kinds of unlimited time to spend with you. You didn’t get I was never lost in big classes or big classrooms. I always had this mentorship that was always available, especially at U of M Flint with Harry Bleicker. And it was this mentorship, I think, that that carried me not only on to Dow, but really carried me on into the rest of my career because I’ve gone back and thought about key points that really made, decisions that led to where I am now, and they always involve an important mentor or a teacher or someone that gave very important critical advice. And you didn’t think it was important at the time until you look back at it in retrospect. But you might wonder, well, where did this lead? Maybe you have other questions, but it did lead to the discovery of of probably one of the biggest scientific discoveries that I’ve had in my career, and that, may be defined as the area of the what they call nowadays dentamers and dendritic polymers. And dendritic polymers really came about because of kind of a fascination with patterns, with any kind of pattern that you could think of whether it be weather patterns for the best days to go fishing or patterns that you might see architecturally in nature.
Dr. Donald Tomalia [00:12:00]:
And I was always fascinated about the branching patterns that we find in the branching of trees. This is really referred to as a dendron, and it is kind of a very rudimentary prototype or model to show just to demonstrate the kind of an ideal branching that one might expect to see in trees. And I was just fascinated, why did nature decide to pick on that kind of architecture for every tree and many, many plants in the world? And I’ve been linked to a little more sophisticated level and asked, why did nature use that same kind of architecture to design the neurons in our brains in a branching patterns, which look very similar to trees, a lot of little trees. That fascinated me. And it raised this really a challenge for me intellectually, and that was, is it possible to make a molecule that might imitate what this architecture looks like or what a tree looks like? And that is what led to this discovery of what we now call the area of dendomers, dendrons, and dendritic materials. And, just to give you a quick overview of it, they were discovered at the Dow Chemical Company in 1979, developed throughout the eighties, and then licensed out, and they became the basis for forming 3 start up companies that I founded. The first one being Dendrotech, which is still in business in Midland, Michigan. They still are making Dendro’s.
Dr. Donald Tomalia [00:13:32]:
And Dendro’s, just to give you a a real quick understanding of what they look like, is shown on this book that I wrote just about 8 or 9 years ago. And this is a dendron. That’s that right there is referred to as a dendron, a trunk with the branches. This is a dendron. This is a tridendron. Precise. You can measure them. You can work with them.
Dr. Donald Tomalia [00:13:54]:
They are nanoscale, and they are being used today for several very important medical areas. And one of them being they are now currently under investigation for the next futuristic COVID virus. Back of this last pandemic that we had there, the person that received the Nobel Prize for coming up with a solution to it, doctor Drew Wiseman, he’s at the University of Pennsylvania in the chemistry. He’s an adjunct in pet chemistry there. He came up with the notion of how we they could use these dendymers to deliver messenger RNA, which we now know is a is the magic ingredient they use for the COVID vaccine. So dendymers, this idea, this obsession I had with patents and especially why trees chose to use them, finally led to just the last few years where now they are being actively looked at, researched, and used, and optimized for, future vaccines that will involve the use of messenger RNA much as they have been used by Pfizer and Moderna too in the last pandemic. The second area that is really active and looking very important is that there’s a company called Star Pharma, which is another story. They are the recipients of many of my patents and they were used these patents to start the initial public offering of their company.
Dr. Donald Tomalia [00:15:23]:
They’re located in Melbourne, Australia and they are currently have some of the best targeted delivery therapies for treating cancer. And I’m talking about some really tough cancers like pancreatic, prostate, and they are able to target specifically these cancers using these dendromeric materials as carriers to carry the therapy. To kinda sum it up, those are some of the smaller areas. There are some other bigger areas that I won’t have time to talk about. But to put it all together in a perspective that you might grasp, it’s kind of as follows. These dendomers represent a 4th major category or classification of polymers that we refer to as dendritic macromolecules. How do they relate to all everything else that we know about in the world called plastics, polymers. If you go back to the first very first polymer that was discovered and invented, it was a linear, like a piece of spaghetti.
Dr. Donald Tomalia [00:16:17]:
And it was a linear polymer, and it was discovered by Staudinger and a number of other very in famous people developed the nylons, corollars, and others. And it’s at the bottom here, and it’s called that is part of what poses the first category of polymers or linear materials. The second area, polymers, major architectural area of polymers are the crosslink polymers that we are everywhere in our life, and they’re found in every tire that you’ve you’ve ever put on the car is a crosslink polymer. So these are crosslink polymers play a huge role in our lives, not only for tires and epoxies and for coatings, but for a whole variety of needs that we have for salver and other areas. And then the third is much less well recognized, but it’s the simple branch polymers, which is the third category here, and it’s now being used on a routine basis at the Dow Chemical Company and VA, the other major chemical companies. And it is what defines and develops the toughness that you find in in these shopping bags. Carry you got a shopping bag and they don’t rip apart pull apart that easily. It’s the toughness that they have is due to the low density of simply branched polyethylene.
Dr. Donald Tomalia [00:17:33]:
And then our area now might become recognized as the 4th major telestendritic or polymers or hyperbranch system. And first company was founded in Midland, Michigan. It was founded as I took leave of absence from Dow Chemical Company, and it’s still in existence. It was founded in 1991, and it it was a company that Dow eventually bought back from me, but allowed me to have keep some of my patents to develop a second company called Dendritic Nanotechnologies, and that company was founded here in Mount Pleasant. And it was funded partially by Star Pharma who eventually got patents from that, and they, in turn, allowed me to move on and form this 3rd company called Nano Synthons, and we currently are here in Mount Pleasant in a 5,000 square foot laboratory working on various versions and forms of these therapeutic materials shown here. As I’ve been sharing with you, Chris, we’ve been so busy this year because these architectural polymers that are very similar and related to the structures you see here are what we are having so much interest from, not only people around the country here in the US, but all over the world. And they, they are interested in them for new properties that they have brought. Whenever you create a new architecture at the molecular level, I mean, most chemists are very much aware of the fact that when you create a new architecture at the molecular level, you always see brand new properties.
Dr. Donald Tomalia [00:19:09]:
So the big quest for anyone who is in science or especially chemistry is if you can create new architecture at the molecular level, you will absolutely expect to see brand new properties, and everybody wants to see new properties because then it creates new possibilities, whether it’s procuring cancer or raising more food more productively or improving the environment or whatever. And so this is where we are as we speak today is we are at we are going beyond and further, I should say, into this path and this journey with Dendamers, and we are working with groups all over all over the US as well as in several from Europe. And that keeps me very busy even in my 8th decade of life, and I guess I’ve been actively working for probably 6 decades or more. In any case, to make a long story short about getting bored about solving problems, chemistry has really been a great friend and has served me well because it has this unique characteristic about itself that once you solve the problem, so many new questions are created that you never have an m. You always have something that you have to think about solving or understanding. That has left me in a state of excitement even in my 8th decade, and I have never had a moment of boredom, I can tell you, because of this profession I chose. And I’m really eternally grateful to U of M Flint for being there at the right time that I needed this means to get started because they really without the U of M Flint, I don’t think I could have afforded to go to one of these fancier colleges out east because it was only because they were close by. I could commute to them to that location, and I had scholarships and funding not only by U of M Board of Regents, but by local scholarship granting agencies in the Flint, Flushing area.
Dr. Donald Tomalia [00:21:11]:
And all I can say is I’ve had a full life, and I’m very grateful for that. I’m just very grateful for the fact that the U of M was there and was the right place to get started. And by the way, I found and I will tell anybody that is willing to listen to me. I got probably one of the best educations that you could ever find anywhere in the country. And I’m I’m adjunct professor at University of Pennsylvania as we speak in chemistry. I’m adjunct professor at the University of Virginia Commonwealth University in Richmond in physics. I’m adjunct there in physics department. And everybody says, well, how where did you get your great background in all these areas? And It goes right back to the small classes that I was so blessed to be able to attend at U of M Flint and the amazing mentors that were there at the time.
Dr. Donald Tomalia [00:22:03]:
And I’m missing a lot of the names. I didn’t need to go back and relook up many of the other faculty members, but the one that stands out most to me is professor Harry Blecker. And I believe his son still lives in the Flint area and works at UConn Flint as I understand it.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:18]:
You’ve had a very busy career. And you as you said, you you made that jump from what is now Mott Community College to the University of Michigan Flint. And then you went to Bucknell, and then you ended up at Michigan State University. And in each of those stages, in each of those opportunities, when you transition into a new type of educational entity or environment, there’s a transition that you go through, and you found success. When you went to Lucknow. You went to Michigan State. You found success. You got your degrees.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:22:49]:
You were able to continue your education and get gainfully employed as we’ve been hearing about. So thinking back on those transitions, you found success. What did you have to do in each of those transitions to set yourself up for success? And what did you have to do to maintain that success throughout each of those unique graduate school experiences?
Dr. Donald Tomalia [00:23:11]:
That’s really an insightful question, and it’s not an easy one to answer because it involved a number of parameters and a number of variables. I have in this insatiable curiosity to understand and know how things work. I’m still struggling with and trying to understand what’s required to create life itself. It sounds philosophical, but it’s a technically big and curious question to me. And chemistry, as it turns out, was that medium that allowed me to understand all the facts and the details that go into the working and the function of life itself, let alone practically everything that we have in our universe and on this planet. But to answer your question, what were some key things? I think it is pursuing these curiosities and not giving up when you will count came to a stand or a barrier or a big roadblock block just staying persistent, perhaps taking a a break and working in another area and eventually coming back. All of these various kinds of occurrences happen throughout that journey. But I think it’s just having a strong curiosity, a strong persistence, and understanding, trying to come to the bottom of the, question and understand what really is making this happen or what is really causing something.
Dr. Donald Tomalia [00:24:28]:
And that’s something that you get only if you you have an opportunity to enjoy that only if you are enjoying what you are doing. And I believe that’s a big part of the secret for my happiness at my stage after all these years in this area. I’ve really never had a boring day. I can honestly say I never had to work a day in my life. This has been one great big hobby that has given me not only a great living, but it’s given me all kinds of joy and understanding. I’m doing a deep level of satisfaction about understanding things about the university that I would never had a reason to pursue had it not been to try to understand the chemistry behind it.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:25:09]:
Now as you think back to your graduate education and you think about people that are thinking about graduate school now, whether it’s in chemistry, whether it’s in English, it doesn’t really matter. What are some tips that you would want to leave with others that are considering graduate education that would help them find success sooner?
Dr. Donald Tomalia [00:25:26]:
I always felt identifying a good mentor, a person that is willing to spend the time with you, has confidence in your ability and your interest and in your willingness to work hard. But if you find that kind of a person or what I call an ideal mentor, they very often fill in all these gaps where you feel some doubt that, am I going the right way, or is this the way I should be moving on in my life? It’s these mentors that come along the way. And I happen to have, as I mentioned, some 3 or 4 very important ones, and they all, of all things, had the first name Harold. At U of M Flint, it was Harold Liker. At Michigan State University, it was Harold Hart. At Bucknell University, it was Harold Heine. It was a coincidence that they all had the first name Harold, but they were all major mentors that stood out in my career as make helping me make some very important decisions and opening my eyes to some very important possibilities. And I really do have no idea what luck is.
Dr. Donald Tomalia [00:26:28]:
I don’t actually really believe in luck. I really believe hard work creates luck. Luck is something that people that should be to pay a success to. Oh, you’re lucky because you you got this to happen because you were lucky. No. In my opinion, in my life, it’s always been a lot of hard work that seems to create the possibilities that things happen that are good, that people call luck. And I firmly believe hard work is really the origin of luck good luck and success, and it takes different forms. It may mean sometimes your wife is not happy because she’s spending too much time thinking science and chemistry and math thinking, maybe more, down to earth possibilities like getting the trash carried out or getting the lawn cut.
Dr. Donald Tomalia [00:27:15]:
So it is really sometimes being too passionate about an area as I am with chemistry, if you be these issues that people don’t understand that you can be so excited that you wanna spend a lot of your time thinking about a particular area or doing things in an area called, in my case, chemistry.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:27:33]:
Well, Donald, I just wanna say thank you. Thank you for sharing your own educational journey, but how that educational journey really led you to all of the discoveries, but also through the years of passion that you had with this, we’ll say, hobby that has led to a career, which has led to the entirety of your profession and what you have identified and created throughout that period of time. And I really appreciate you sharing that with us, and I look forward to sharing it with others, and I truly wish you the best.
Dr. Donald Tomalia [00:28:07]:
Thank you very much, Chris. And I just wanna say I am truly impressed, and I’m really very pleased to see how much progress in the advancements that have been made at the U of M campus in Flint. When I arrived there a few months ago back at for my first visit after probably 20 or 30 years, I couldn’t even imagine or believe how much you have grown and how nicely you have grown. So leave it to say, as we finish, I’m left with some very fond and treasured memories of my days at Flint U of M, and I would highly recommend that campus to anybody, especially if you’re having a financial or money problem where you can’t afford to go to Harvard or to Stanford or wherever. And it gives you an education that holds up anywhere, in my opinion. In fact, many people could not believe that I had such a great grounding and a such a great background created by my experience at a small campus such as U of M Flint. So I will be forever beholding, to that opportunity I had in Flint. And I really appreciate you taking the time, Chris, to allow me to share this story and this little bit of my life.
Dr. Donald Tomalia [00:29:17]:
There are a lot of other things I could tell you about, which would take way too much time, but I truly enjoyed this moment with you. Thank you.
Dr. Christopher Lewis [00:29:24]:
The University of Michigan Flint has a full array of masters and doctorate programs if you are interested in continuing your education. Whether you’re looking for in person or online learning options, the University of Michigan Flint has programs that will meet your needs. For more information on any of our graduate programs, visit umflint.edu/graduateprograms to find out more. Thanks again for spending time with me as you prepare to be a victor in grad school. I look forward to speaking with you again soon as we embark together on your graduate school journey. If you have any questions or want to reach out, email me at [email protected].
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